From: Paul Tissink Bob Burton wrote: > > I'm needing tires in about a month or less and I have riden Kevin > Hawkin's bike with the Macadams 90X(120/70, 180/55 setup) and liked > this setup. Anyone out there that can give me feedback on Battlax tires > like BT54 or BT57? As I understand it the BT54 is the higher mileage > tire (sport/touring tire) and the BT57 is the BT50 (sport tire) > replacement. Would like input on dry/wet grip, mileage, and sizes used. > Everyone I know with a sport bike like BT50's best of all tires on the > market but only get 4000-5000 miles from them (rear tire) I wonder if > the BT57 are any better on mileage. I'm convinced the 120/70 front and > 180/55 rear are the sizes I will buy, now trying to decide on a brand. > Kevin, how many miles on the Macadams now??? and how are they holding > up? Any other users of Macadams with high mileage? > Thanks...Bob Bob, I ride with BT57 120/70 front and 180/55 rear and am extremely satisfied. I've done 5000 KM with them now, and up until now no low speed wobble no cupping, just tons of grip and smooth cornering behaviour. Steering is lighter and quicker, no understeer what_so_ever, just point and turn. The bike was complimented on it's cornering capabilities by a friend of mine while riding Holland's famous winding dikes, who in everyday life rides a Yam ThunderAce ! Need I say more ? Paul ---------------------------------------------------- From: Ronald Ray Carlson After the stock Dunlop tires, I bought the Michelin: A89X front, M89X rear. I have been happy with their performance, but am ready for a new rear tire, thinking I may keep the present A89X front since it seems to have a lot of miles left in it. I ride for pleasure, enjoying a long ride as well as a good curvy road, often with my wife. I am looking for a recommendation, should I buy the same or are there now better choices for my use? ---------------------------------------------------- From: Richard Lanouette For Michelin, there "official" replacement for the GTS is the 90X. With two setup : 130/60 front and 170/60 rear as stock or the newer setup than seem to please the one that tried it : 120 / 70 front and 180/55 rear. The 90x is have good traction. Better than stock and 89X, not as good as Battlax. You can put lots of milage on it, have good handling and good wet and cold traction. ---------------------------------------------------- -- [ From: Robert Wilson * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] -- I run the x89's as well & have been told that the x89's weren't very popular & are generally replaced by the much superior x90's. I have heard that the x90's have the same wear & much more stick. I have found the x89's have more stick than the stock Dunlops. Robert ---------------------------------------------------- From: khawkins@hrncgate.ims.att.com >I'd love to try a GTS that's 100~150 lbs lighter, and possibly has a >slightly smaller turning radius. Dropping the weight would make a >bike that handles better than the BMW at high speeds, and is >flickable. On the BMW, I could do the typical "cone weave" course >solely with body steering (weighting the pegs, the Reg Pridmore >CLASS method). There's no way that's possible on the GTS! On the >BMW, I was most likely to run off the road by either washing out the >front end or spinning the back tire on road-surface crap (neither >happended). On the GTS, I'd suggest just running wide. It takes >noticbly more effort to get the Yamaha to start to turn. Mark, you make a lot of comments about the GTS that I would have made up to 6 months ago. The difference......120/70 front, 180/55 rear AND keep the tire pressures at 38-40 psi. With my GTS equipped this way, the front end turns in with much less effort and STAYS there without constant bar pressure. She even responds to peg pressure!! I loved my Ducati because of the way it responds to body steering and simply thought that the GTS didn't because it's too heavy. Not any more! I don't believe that it matches the nimbleness of the BMW because the RS places it's weight much lower and therefore responds to the "Lever" action of peg pressure more readily, but she's much improved with the new tire sizes and TIRE PRESSURE. Kevin Hawkins // Greensboro, NC ---------------------------------------------------- Stephen Furr wrote: > > 1) Stable, smooth straight line running > 2) Good braking traction (wet and dry) > 3) High milage > 4) Ultimate cornering strength > Obviously I don't ride really hard through the twisties, > but I don't want to have really hard rocks for tires, either. > Does the 90X Macadams sound like the ticket? > Thanks, > Stephen Just from my own personal experience, I got the best mileage with the Metzlers, but I now have the Avon Azaro's on & I can't begin to tell you how much nicer the ride is with these tires plus they stick like glue and British tires are engineered more for wet weather than the rest I believe. Just my .02 Bob Taylor,gtsbiker ---------------------------------------------------- From: "Steve Litscher" Bob, I'm using the Dunlop Sportmax 180/55 on the rear and have plenty of clearance all around, even with the stock sub fender. I don't think the profile on the BT-57 could be a whole lot different. ---------------------------------------------------- > Bob Burton wrote: > > > > Anyone using the Bridgestone BT-57's please confirm for me that the > > 180/55 rear tire does fit with the stock sub fender. I think it does but > > want to make sure since several people have removed the subfender. > > Thanks...Bob (ordering new tires next week) > > It does. > > Paul > (120/70 & 180/55 BT57) ---------------------------------------------------- tube@ecr.net wrote: > > What size of Azaros? I haven't heard anything good about Avons in the > past. What has changed? > Where are the Tapered steering head bearings obtained. I can't see that > it's worth laying out the installation money to do it now, but I would > like to know for future reference. > > Tom Ruggles To be honest, you don't hear much of anything at all about Avon tires but I've used them in the past and had good luck with them, particularly in the wet.Thier new variable density belt must be the main difference but I just know that they stuck really well and gave a superior quality ride to ANY other tire I've tried. As for mileage,its a little early to tell yet with only about 500mi on them.I'm using the 180/55-120/70 combo and if anyone is interested the shop where I get my stuff said she could sell them to anybody in the group for---180rear-$152.95, 170rear-$145.95, 120front-$115.95 all plus shipping bob taylor ---------------------------------------------------- > From: Robert Spitz > Hi all.... > I have a 93 Model GTS and is due for a new set of tyers.. > The manual recommends 120/70 on the front and 170/60 on the back... > I have been running Dunlop's Super/sport tourers 130/70 front and 180/55 > on the rear.. > Unfortunately Dunlop have stopped importing these models... > > I have read that most GTS owners have gone to a 120/60 front.... > What is the difference btw 180/55 rear and a 170/60 rear as far as > handeling//// > > Also, Avon are finally releasing the new Azaro,s Which are only > available in > a 120/70and 170/60 Bloody pricey down here.. $ 600 AU. for the set... > > Has any one got any advice please ????? ---------------------------------------------------- From: "George Giamarellos" I've tryed a lot of tyres on my GTS. From stock Bridgestones, to Avon and Michelin. Two months ago I decided to change my Michelins. As I have friends that race bikes here in Greece and two good friends with tyre shop I was delighted when they gave me the opportunity to try a lot of their tyres in many dimensions( they stock and use for their bikes more than 40 pairs per year). After four changes we all agreed that the best were the Pirelli Dragon Corsa (MTR02) 120/70 front, 170/55 rear. We decided to fit 120/70 in front for these reasons: smaller "face" than the 130 stock for easier turning and feel, same diameter, and as the Greek roads have some bumps more rubber to protect the rim. Afterall we didn't feel any real difference with the 120/60, except more "road feel" on your steering ("road feel" is a minus for the GTS). The rear is too large on 180 and the power of the bike does not justify it. Stick on 170. We choose the Pirelli Dragon Corsa for its ability to warm up earlier than any other and also for the reason that I prefer to change my tyres every 10.000 km or once a year, so the softer rubber does not affect my wallet. Until now it is the best tyre that i ever used. It transforms the GTS to a different kind of bike. Although on wet it is not as good as my Michelins, on the dry is really something else from the rest. If you can handle the fact that you will need earlier a new pair of tyres (and the fact that spinning your rear wheel will leave a black line more costly than any other brand!) try them on your GTS, you will be amazed. If you don't have bumps on the roads that you travel use a 120/60 front for better feel, but for rear we believe that something more than 170 is a waste as the more "face" of a 180 will not be used on a bike like the GTS. Although the Dragon Corsas were designed for lighter bikes they work excellent with the beast. ---------------------------------------------------- > >>After four changes we all agreed that the best were > >>the Pirelli Dragon Corsa (MTR02) 120/70 front, 170/55 rear. > > Here in the states the 170/55 is not a common tire size so we are left > with either the 180/55 or 170/60 rear. > > >>The rear is too large on 180 and the power of the bike does > >>not justify it. Stick on 170. > > I've wondered this myself. Whether staying with the 170/60 rear and > simply changing to a 120/70 front is best. I've got the 180/55 rear, > 120/70 front on now and the combination works fabulously. Oh well, > something else to think about. I'm currently running a 120/70 ME-Z1F with a 170/55 ME-Z1R Racing-compound. I love the easy transitions the front gives, but I'm not entirely happy with how the rear makes the bike track. The difference is very subtle, but I think the 170/60 ME-Z2 tracked better. It might be that I need to experiment with different pressures again. Regardless of how it tracks, the thing sticks like glue! There is a small difference in tach to speedometer relationship. At 80mph indicated, the tach used to show 5000rpm. Now it's about 5200. I changed both ends, but I believe the rear is mostly responsible for this number shift. In theory, there should be a small increase in torque. Next time, I think I'll go back to the 170/60 ME-Z2R for tread-life and peace-of-mind reasons. (I prefer the idea of the rear sliding first.) or maybe the equivalent Pirelli(still a Metzler). _ o _ / = > Later, _ (_)==(_) Don ---------------------------------------------------- cumminjs%geds@mhsgate.salem.ge.com (Cummins Joe S) Subject: Avon Azaro's: pricing info The good news: Motorcycle Accessory Warehouse 800-241-2222 Front: AV 35 120/70 ZR 17 $99.95 Rear: AV 36 170/60 ZR 17 $127.95 Shipping: $24 to me in VA The bad news: Local dealer wants $38 in labor PLUS $16 in balancing ---------------------------------------------------- From: Mark Bergman TIRES: I put on Avaon Azaros (120/70f, 180/55r) about 500 miles ago. Love those tires. Compared to the stock Dunlops, they're great! The steering effort is lessened, they stick much better, and (kinda embarassed here) I think they even look K00l, dude! Of course, compared to the Dunlops, the steel rims stick well... One interesting point...when I got the tires changed, I took the opportunity to check my tire gauge against the shop's... Mine was off by 6 lbs! Too much time banging around in a tank bag, I guess. Remember, checking your tires and keeping the air "up" doesn't help much if the gauge is way off... ---------------------------------------------------- Why is no one using the MEZ1 Rear? Does it wear out too quickly? Hmmm....When I last purchased a set of MEZs I went with the Z1 front Z2 rear because I believe that the Z2 didn't come in size 130/60-17 front. Or maybe the Z1 wasn't available in 170/60-17. Anway, they did wear out about the same time. Nice tires except they tend to get a flat spot on the centerline if you don't head for the mountains occasionally. Kevin Hawkins // Greensboro, NC ---------------------------------------------------- Tires - Okay, we've been through this before. Most of the info can be found in the GTS archives: http://www.moto.net/archives/GTS1000 . In short, the OEMs D202 suck, the MEZ1 front Z2 rear are good as are Pirelli Dragons. The Bridgestone BT-57s and Avon Azaros and currently being evaluated by several GTS members with early returns showing favorably for the Bridgestones. Too soon to tell on the Avons. The Michelin Macadams are a good tire but the front is almost gone at 3000 miles with plenty left on the rear. The 120/70 front and 180/55 or 170/60 rear is the way to go no matter what tire you choose. Go with tire pressures around 38 front/ 40 rear. The combination of these tire pressures and new profile front will dramatically transform the GTS front end. -------------------------------------- I went to the Metler MEZ1's a last month. The tires have great traction, great feed back. The wet traction is below average. All of this is in MHO. Louis Tweed -------------------------------------- I went from the originals to Avon Azaro's. I like them, they inspire confidence and haven't suggested any problems with wet roads. There is one problem: Quality. The rear tire has a high spot which my mechanic thinks is causing front wobble. The replacement they ordered was WORSE! Blatant opinion part: Damn I wish I could go over there and fix those guys - this quality stuff GE's been teaching me lately would really straighten them out. Eric J. Kauffman -------------------------------------- From: Mark Bergman I put Avon Azaros on ~2,500 miles ago. No complaints. No quality problems. I went with the 120/70 (? smaller than stock) front. I don't know it it was the Avons or the size change, but the bike feels so much better! The Avons stick really well, and feel quite good in the rain. My only concern is the wear--the GTS is a heavy bike, and I often ride with a passenger and luggage, and do too many highway miles in order to get to the twisties. I'd be happy to get 7,500+ miles out of the tires before the rear gets too square. We'll see... -------------------------------------- On the original tires I got 6,800 miles out of them. Front tires was cupping pretty badly and the rear had a good sized flat spot. I then put on Battle-ax BT-50. I got 6,200 miles out of those and I was down to the wear indicators on the rear, the front was in pretty good shape still, probably has a couple thousand miles left on it. This spring I put on MEZ1 front and MEZ2 rear in the stock sizes. So far I have put 1,100 miles on them, about 300 of which are the twisties. Like the MEZ's better than any of the other tires I have had on the bike. Better stability in the corners, better traction in a straight line (Inadvertently spun the Dunlop's a couple of times), have not had any problems in the rain. Next spring I would like to try either the Azaro's or the Macadam X-90. Then I will decide from those which one I will run after that. I usually ride one up with 60% of my mileage is driving back and forth to work, the other 40% is riding the 90 miles to some decent twisties. Trent Ryan oure124@deere.com -------------------------------------- > I got about 10k miles from the stock dunlops. Then I purchased a set > of Dunlop D205's and they are a much better improvement from the D202's. > I have had them for about 3k miles and dry and wet weather traction > are much better. And the rear looks as if it will last more than 10k. > > stan Watch those Dunlop's, I hope you have better luck than I did. The tires were done after about 6000 miles, and the front & back had cupped. I do have to say they rode great wet or dry. Louis -------------------------------------- So far I have found the Macadam 90x to be excellent tires. I rode all winter long in snow, rain, and slush. They sucked on snow! :) Other than that they are pretty swell tires. Kevin -------------------------------------- kelly, there has been quite a bit of response on tire usage. for my self i have tried the metzler mez 1front and mez2 in the rear, bridgestone battleaxe bt57 and the dunlop 204. my personal favorite for wear and stick would be the metzler with the bt57 being next and a very close second. the dunlops i didnt care for. if the bike was lighter so the wear factor was was better i would like the dunlops but they go away too fast about 3000 miles. the metzlers gave the most confidence and predictability and were about equal in wear with the bt57. the bt57 was just about the same as the metzler for ride and stick but i got a very slight cupping in the front but the tire still lasted for 8000 miles. the rear bt57 lasted for about 6000 miles however the last 2000 were two up with bags full running at 90 to 120 mph through the backroads of nevada and i was amazed how fast the last 40% of the tire went away. there has been a lot of discussion on tire size and i have on currently a 120 front and 180 rear. to me it seemed like the bike lost a little ground clearance and the steering seemed different so i checked the catalogue and found that the 120-70 is taller than stock and the rear 180-55 is shorter in diameter than stock. this put the front end higher and back end lower which would change the steering geometry slightly and account for the slight change in handeling and ground clearence. my next tires i will go back to the stock size in the metezler mez. i hope this helps you bob -------------------------------------- > From: Hawkins, Kevin MBnet.MB.CA> > The BT-57s are primo tires. I have to agree with Kevin, after more than 7000 miles on my trip I had to change tires. I find a set of BT-50 (now the BT-57 how are better). The front tire V shape make the GTS very responsive. Even with the 130 / 60 at 36 psi, you just think about turning and the bike lean and stay that way. It does'nt try to came back up. The tire feel very confident, I was able to lean to the "chicken line" a first for me. (But nothing touch the ground..except my feet). I'll probably go with the stickier BT-56 next time. Later ! richardl@bigfoot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- I just installed the 120/70 180/55 tire combination that so many recommended. The initial impression is WOW! It handles like it shed 75 lbs. Here's the question. I'm leaving for a week long trip Tuesday and want to know how much I need to adjust the speedometer reading with the new tires. Tom Ruggles 93 Yamaha GTS, 80 Honda CBX ------------------------------------------------------------ Tom, the "aspect" ratio is nearly the same when looking at a 170x60 vs. 180X55. There is little difference. Besides, speedo's are not exact anyway... Forget it... Just enjoy the new tires.... Digitalfoot... ------------------- From: Bob Burton To: Kelly.Cash@Corp Subject: Re: Tires - Again! -Reply Kelly, I like the BT57's I put on alot especially the 120/70 front. BIG difference on the front go with it. The back I will probably go back to the 170/60 rear instead of the 180/55 I have. BT57's do have center groove on the front but I don't have any problem with it. My tires aways wear out on the sides before the center (I like the twisties) and in tour mode I bet the BT57's could do 10K mi or better. I've got 4Kmi now and expect about 6~7Kmi max due to the sides (ie the soft rubber on these dual compound tires) being worn out. My .02 for you , I already gave this to Tony...Bob ----------------------- Subject: Metzeler MEZ 4 Was surprised to hear that Alan Tooraen experienced a traction problem with the Metzeler MEZ 4. I have not tried these tires on the GTS, but have on test evaluations for the magazine I'm involved with. Once was on the Ducati ST2 and the other was a the BMW k1200. Each time poor traction was not an issue. I think I would look at tire pressures and suspension set up as a possible fix. I know the GTS feels better with higher tire pressures, but those tires didn't like running inflated hard; it took a long time to get heat into them, and they cooled off easily on 55-70degree days.(Great for mileage, though.) We ran them as low as 32 front, 34 rear, and as high as 40 front, 42 rear. The Duck always worked great, but when the suspension was soft on the heavy K-bike, it would sometimes overwhelm the tire when the suspension approached the bottom of the travel- especially at higher pressures. Playing with the set-up helped that bike a lot. I believe Metzeler has tech support at 610.458.9662. Ride on. Fabrizio --------------------- Just got my bike back from the shop having 12K service and new tires put on. First set of BT57's (120/70 & 180/55) were wore out at 6500 miles. Front tire was on the wear bars on the sides and the rear was on the wear bars all the way around. I got a new set of BT57's and Competition Acc. shipped me a 180/55 BT57G which is a OEM replacement tire for the CBR11XX. I didn't ask for it but that is what they shipped. This tire seems slightly wider than the regular BT57 of the same size but it does still fit FYI. This second BT57 (120/70) front tire also required no weights to balance it just like the first one. From: Bob Burton --------------------- Bridgestone describes the BT-54 as Sport Touring and the BT-57 as Sports Performance. It looks like you might want to go with the BT-54 although I've experienced 8-10K miles on the BT-57. The BT-57 is their newer tire with Dual Compound and Silica technology. To me it's the better all around tire, but the BT-54 does offer a deeper tread depth. I think you'd be happy either way Dan. Kevin Hawkins // Greensboro, NC